What can we do?

[GunnersFan]

Hello all, I have been a huge fan of women's bodybuilding for years, but I have noticed (one would have to be blind not to see it) that recently there has been an attack on the sport and on the women who make the sport what it is. I knew things were going down hill when ESPN stopped covering FBB, and instead decided to cover such sports or events as the Outdoor Games, and the National Spelling Bee. What in the world is going on :confused:

Now it seems as the powers that be are trying to destroy FBB all together, with new new rulling on too much muscle (I forgot the percentage), the lack of support for the various shows, and then the talk of canceling the Ms Olympia, the LACK of prize money. Well enough is enough!!! Something must be done. . . but what?

What can the fans do to support our wonderful women of iron? I started this thread so that maybe we can get some ideas flowing back and forth and who knows, maybe just maybe we can come up with some solution. Because I love the sport, and I don't want to see it die off. So what can we do?

[HumanFreakShow300]

Well, i am not sure how much can be done, but i do agree with you in that something should be done. Maybe, for starters, there should be the creation of an Online petition that users can sign, which would then be forwarded to the IFBB and other organizations that influence women's bodybuilding. Of course this would only be a start, but if nothing else, it would show that there is an audience for these events and that there are supporters interested.

Too, there would have to be some way to reach out to the active participants that do not wish to see their hard work end up being all for naught, so that they too can push forward in the fight to keep their competitive dreams alive. Another thing that may initiate some kind of change is to write letters to the officials that are making up the rules and, in essence, dictating what's going on, with urges to bring about worthwhile changes in the arena of female bodybuilding.

Just some thoughts. i am not a fbb, but i do dupport it, and if the women that compete want to bring about sensible change, then they too must -- above everyone else -- take action.

[Maxt]

That ruling may not neccessarily be adhered to and may be focusing on the Olympia. There could be an attempt afoot not to ruin women's bodybuilding, but to streamline and refine it. A lot of great female bodybuilding competitors have left the sport because they did not want to have to carry all of that muscle in the off season. I am all for femininity guidelines so that aesthetics are not compromised and so that from the Ms. Olympia on down the rankings a female bodybuilder could be admired for her hard work and wonderful body, but not always castigated as may be the case most recently.

[strong woman]

Miss Olympia is not cancelled as far as I know. The whole show has been moved to The Orleans in Las Vegas. The Expo will be somewhere different, at the Las Vegas Convention Centre.

I always find these king of posts a little funny because whoever starts it always lumps FBB together thinking it is only competive bb that counts. Yes we might be taking a hammering in the press, nothing new there. The bigger picture is better though, many new women are getting into training. I am so pleased about that. Not everyone will make it to a stage and there is no way you can blame them with the treatment they will be getting from show promoters, judges, lack of sponsor ship jobs for women, bb press not printing anything with women bb and so on. Just look at the difference in price money... At the Arnold the men's winner gets $100.000 plus a hummer car. The overall women gets $17.000????

I want everyone to be able to do what they want with the support of others, without having to justify their choices even if it is not for us. I would never go up to someone who I thought were too fat, skinny, taking drugs (like e and cocaine), drinking, smoking and other things and tell them what I thought they should do. I respect their choice even though I might not agree with it. After all we should have freedom of choice and not worry about pleasing others!

I think as well that we will have to accept that the look of a pro bb will never appeal to that many people (wheter it is a male or female bb) and just get on with enjoying what we like best: training, diet and living the life style of a resposible bb!

Hanne

[wekes989]

The New York Muscle Club (never actually been to one) really opened my eyes as to what can be done to continue exposure for female bodybuilding, supporting the women, and of course, there's the admirers.
The setting seemed intimate, and the participants were the center of attention as opposed to being the ridiculed sideshow to the male show (like a bodybuilding contest).
Plus, I'm sure the women would be much more comfortable not having to enter a show with 0.5% body fat, oiled up and darkened from spending three-quarters of their time in one of those tanning coffins.
Will the mainstream ever accept female bodybuilding? No. Will they accept it if it did not supposedly contain steroids? Still no. The maintstream are a funny folk. Give them a dog show on TSN, they're perfectly content. Give them a bodybuilding show, they're appalled. I never said the mainstream were particularly smart.
Anyhow, perhaps something like the New York Muscle Club will be the way of the future for those who participate in, or have respect for, female bodybuilding. It's creative, entertaining, and (probably most important) hopefully supportive.

[Beenaround]

You are very correct. The mainstream thing is never going to happen, but if we as fbbers could show the public even if it is individually in our respective residences to excude ourselves as professionals, not just in our athletic pursuits, but our personal, academic, work enviornment outlets, maybe we could educate them this way at least.(I'm trying to get Eric, who does the NYMC to do one in the future.I will be in PA area soon and would like to put my own show on in the future. Or something like Lori Fernstein did in NY again with the art exibit format.

[genex]

Michelle, I agree, stuff like Laurie Fierstein's show and other ways to present the sport in an artistic way are a good medium for introducing it to others.

Hanne, I hadn't heard yet that the O was the Orleans. Wow what a switch :)

gene

[HumanFreakShow300]

The mainstream thing is never going to happen, but if we as fbbers could show the public even if it is individually in our respective residences to excude ourselves as professionals, not just in our athletic pursuits, but our personal, academic, work enviornment outlets, maybe we could educate them this way at least. I...would like to put my own show on in the future. Or something like Lori Fernstein did in NY again with the art exibit format.

This i can get with, but i think that at the end of the day it all comes down to personal interests. If there is no (substantial) audience, then what? The entire arena needs more exposure; That's it! You can have a hundred shows, but if there is no promotion beyond the reaches of the die-hard fans, it will never grow exponentially beyond that point.

Case in point; Anyone remember skateboarding? Yeah, once upon a time this was practically a crime -- no skateboarding signs were everywhere, there were very, very few skate parks, and the cops, shopkeepers, etc., would hassle the kids that did it. However, if you look at that climate now, it is just about everywhere. Also, the media coverage is tremenndous -- everyone knows about the X Games. Skateboarders now have video games, clothing lines, shoes, magazines, ESPN coverage, etc. big-money sponsorships are all over their equipment, clothing, etc. The skateboarders kept pushing and pushing to get it where it is today.

My point is, we need a greater push. We need more solid promotion that will bring about more positive exposure. i don't think it is about trying to get or waiting for the mainstream to come to (read accept) 'us', but for 'us' to go over to their side -- i.e. use patience a gentle hand to cram it down their throats.

[strong woman]

The Olympia (Miss and Mr) are all being held in Las Vegas at the Orleans hotel, a little off the strip.


Hanne

[eseiple]

ALL I can say , is ATTACK away...But Im Not going ANYWHERE and neither are a lot of other women out there.....:):)

[genex]

That kind of spirit is awesome Elena and that's also how a lot of women bodybuilders are. It takes a lot to do it as a sport/lifestyle and although it may never become mainstream, at least people are doing it for the right reasons.

gene

[strong woman]

Yes and that is why I will always support the women any way I can!!!

Hanne

[Beenaround]

Ha Ha Elena!! Iwas working out tonight and they were doing a shoot for advertisement(it's a Golds, a crappy one,by the way)and were using my friend who is a trainer there and he is a good size guy(I'm actually helping him get ready for a show and they used a skinny girl, like he was training her on the equipment. Did they ask me??? Nooooooo.
I just don't care anymore, I was benching anyway, and don't mess with my "real" training :mad: :p

[eseiple]

Listen i have come to the conclusion that ITS NOT DEAD...Media is just trying to tell us its Dead and if they say it enough perhaps we will listen and give in....Bottem line....Look at the lineup for the NY Pro and tell me its dead...
Look at the Nationals last year and the lineup for the USA this year and tell me its dead?

You can tell me its dead until you are blue in the face...but that will not stop me from going to the gym and stepping on that stage!

[Amanda Dunbar]

Exactly.... 33 women in the line-up. It's definitely not dead. It's going to be a great show. Wish you were going Elena!!!!

A

[hans]

ALL I can say , is ATTACK away...But Im Not going ANYWHERE and neither are a lot of other women out there.....:):)

Right on Elena! I'm as annoyed as anyone about the lack of coverage of women's bodybuilding in the magazines, on TV etc, but I think we sometimes have a tendency to equate the visibility of fbbers in the media with the sport itself. Like Elena says, as long as there are fbbers out there in gyms, no-one can say the sport's dying or dead.

Hans

[bigjoeyc]

Exactly.... 33 women in the line-up. It's definitely not dead. It's going to be a great show. Wish you were going Elena!!!!

A

Its the fans and the great athletes that will keep the sport strong.

[bigjoeyc]

Now it seems as the powers that be are trying to destroy FBB all together, with new new rulling on too much muscle (I forgot the percentage), the lack of support for the various shows, and then the talk of canceling the Ms Olympia, the LACK of prize money. Well enough is enough!!! Something must be done. . . but what?

Hey, how do you guys/ladies feel about the too much muscle rule? I assumed that most would be against it, but I was reading an interview with Melissa Dettwiller on TrueBodies and this is what she said:

"TB: What are your thoughts on the state of women’s bodybuilding today?
MD: I’m very happy with the new 20% guideline. I think women's bodybuilding was dying because nobody wanted to look at what was walking on stage anymore...for the most part....not even fellow male bodybuilders. when one cannot HONESTLY tell the difference from a man and a woman except for a set of implants.....and some lipstick....Houston...we have a problem!"

Here is the link to the page if you wanna read the whole thing. http://www.truebodies.com/profiles/melissa_dettwiller/melissa.htm

Is that how most of you feel? Just wondering. :confused:

Thanks, Joey C

[genex]

I think the way the rule was implemented was a bit ridiculous, but if what they want to achieve is more of the look of the 80s female bodybuilders, that's one way to do that. I just think that saying 20% is not the way to do it.

Personally if someone can carry the muscle, I have no problem with it, but if people are just trying to add mass for mass sake, then for the sport of bodybuilding as a whole it's probably not the best idea, although there will always be the mass freaks, and I have to admit I can enjoy that side of things. After all, the sport is a bit extreme as it is...

gene

[eseiple]

I don't think the way everyone is taking it is the way it was intended. JM never states that ALL fbbs have to reduce by 20%...he states that those that need to meaning as they have been saying since 2000, those that are to the extreme. JM just put a number with it this time, but this is not new news to us. They have been saying since 2000 that they want the women more feminine on stage and if you need to reduce your size to achieve it then this applies to you. Look at the winners the last few years...and it follows that standard. They are not saying you can't have muscle, but you have to know when you are extreme....and you can be extreme in all weight classes.

NEW PROS IN REVIEW and all of them carry their muscularity and feminity perfectly.

Gina Davis
Colette Nelson
Cindy Conzales
Bonnie Priest
Tonia Williams
Just to name a few.

So in my opinion everyone has blown this way out of proportion.

[airnel]

I have been a fan of female bodybuilders since I was 11 yrs old. But there is one thing that will at least make the sport alive if the the athletes themselves look upon them as role models. For example try to do community based projects so that people can be aware of the true side of female bodybuilders. Because alot of people especially in my country the Philippines have this negative perception that fbb's are arrogant persons which I try in my own little way to remove that perception to them. At least not only in projects can the other side can be shown at least when people or fans try to met you. Try to be good at them as you can be. At least when you are on the top and being look up by others. Try to look below and keep your feet on the ground. Prices in the competitions are not really the issue yet it is a factor. But what keeps a fbb going is her pursuit of happiness still to make the sport have a beautiful image, try to make other people know the true side of the sport. It is education also that makes other's change their beliefs to the better. If the persons involved know alot of the situation at least they can do something. What do you think? :)

[bigjoeyc]

I don't think the way everyone is taking it is the way it was intended. JM never states that ALL fbbs have to reduce by 20%...he states that those that need to meaning as they have been saying since 2000, those that are to the extreme. JM just put a number with it this time, but this is not new news to us. They have been saying since 2000 that they want the women more feminine on stage and if you need to reduce your size to achieve it then this applies to you. Look at the winners the last few years...and it follows that standard. They are not saying you can't have muscle, but you have to know when you are extreme....and you can be extreme in all weight classes.

NEW PROS IN REVIEW and all of them carry their muscularity and feminity perfectly.

Gina Davis
Colette Nelson
Cindy Conzales
Bonnie Priest
Tonia Williams
Just to name a few.

So in my opinion everyone has blown this way out of proportion.

Yeah thats true, they do carry muscularity and feminity perfectly. How do you know how to separate the line between extreme and not? :)

[boomboomroom1234]

ya the line up at the NY Pro is HOT. This sport is not dead but at times may look that way but with this line up it sure doesn't. I just hope that more and more young females get into the gym , not all will be a FBB but at least hit the gym and if a few want to be a FBB than that is great.

[Maxt]

I don't think the way everyone is taking it is the way it was intended.
So in my opinion everyone has blown this way out of proportion. That was exactly the impression I got Elena. That is why I never got bent out of shape. I think there needs to be some sort of guideline to ensure an aesthetic of women's bodybuilding that will ensure a great degree of feminity so that the top notch women's bodybuilders of the pro ranks and amateurs will be admired by the aspiring competitors of the future who will take up the sport enthusiastically. I think the ladies you mentioned all look great and don't look as if they compromised any aesthetic principles of femininity to get to the pros. That is why I agree with you 100%.

[Tin Nuts]

JM just put a number with it this time, but this is not new news to us. They have been saying since 2000 that they want the women more feminine on stage and if you need to reduce your size to achieve it then this applies to you. Look at the winners the last few years...and it follows that standard.

Good points, I hadn't considered the less 20 thing from this perspective. Thanks for putting it out there.

[Zennie]

Hello all, I have been a huge fan of women's bodybuilding for years, but I have noticed (one would have to be blind not to see it) that recently there has been an attack on the sport and on the women who make the sport what it is. I knew things were going down hill when ESPN stopped covering FBB, and instead decided to cover such sports or events as the Outdoor Games, and the National Spelling Bee. What in the world is going on :confused:

Now it seems as the powers that be are trying to destroy FBB all together, with new new rulling on too much muscle (I forgot the percentage), the lack of support for the various shows, and then the talk of canceling the Ms Olympia, the LACK of prize money. Well enough is enough!!! Something must be done. . . but what?

What can the fans do to support our wonderful women of iron? I started this thread so that maybe we can get some ideas flowing back and forth and who knows, maybe just maybe we can come up with some solution. Because I love the sport, and I don't want to see it die off. So what can we do?

Hmm. I used to agree with this take, but I don't anymore. I think the reason FBB's aren't on ESPN is that either a show could not be produced that was to their liking or no one pitched them a show.

Remember, show content on ESPN doens't always come from ESPN. ESPN's a network first before a content producer.

So if you want something to be on ESPN, get cracking!

[dogbump]

Hmm. I used to agree with this take, but I don't anymore. I think the reason FBB's aren't on ESPN is that either a show could not be produced that was to their liking or no one pitched them a show.

Remember, show content on ESPN doens't always come from ESPN. ESPN's a network first before a content producer.

So if you want something to be on ESPN, get cracking!

I don't really understand your post Zen. Whaddya mean get cracking? How can we get bodybuilding shows aired on ESPN? I thought they took off the Olympia because a lack or ratings?

Are you saying go pitch it to them? Cuz if that was the case I'd love to see someone in the sport do that! I like The Fit Show from bodybuilding.com.

Perhaps if they tweaked that show a bit ESPN or TSN might air it or something similar. By tweaking I mean making it more "understandable" for lack of a better term to a non-bodybuildng audience. Perhaps it might get them interested in it!

[ibarramedia]

The fit show is cool. But it is no from cable and not from network tv. It is shown via the internet. More work and convincing needs to be done to bring fbb back to tv.

[Eddie]

Bodybuilding will never be back on any brand of television because it not marketable enough.

That's just all there is to it, bodybuilders especially males, are not looked at as true athletes.

There seen as abominations or freaks, like comic book characters. And that unfortunately intimidates a lot of people.

And their always placed on the backburner because this is a society that bases almost everything on looks or than anything else.

I know personality comes into play, and its plenty of BBers who have that, so that can't be an excuse.

Its why you never see a bodybuilder of today on reality, soap opera, criminal drama, or sports shows.

If anything they'll only be seen on the discover channel for the reasons I hightlighted above.

And if they get movie role, its only as some lacky or henchmen or thug whose suppose to get their butt whooped by the heros.

Its good that Inside Edition did a solid piece on Lisa Aukland, but one segment on one show once a year is just not gonna cut it.

So Bodybuilding fans might as well be happy with the internet, because that's where its gonna stay for awhile.

[dogbump]

I don't know Eddie.....I think bodybuilding will be back on TV sooner than we think. It is definately a "cult" sport but the world of fitness is growing as people are slowly becoming more health conscious. I think Figure is also drawing in alot of interest. Oxygen mags fly off the shelves now.

I certainly hope it becomes a bit more mainstream, but what they are doing with it over the internet seems to be working pretty good for now.

[Tre]

So Bodybuilding fans might as well be happy with the internet, because that's where its gonna stay for awhile.

'Might as well be happy with'??

Dude, this is the best it's ever BEEN!

Instead of having to wait 30 days or more between 'fixes' back when all I could get were print mags or worse, having to wait *months* between TV appearances, I now get to enjoy bodybuilder around the clock every day from the comfort of my own home.

If you're complaining about that, then I really don't think there's any way that you can be satisfied.

[ibarramedia]

'Might as well be happy with'??

Dude, this is the best it's ever BEEN!

Instead of having to wait 30 days or more between 'fixes' back when all I could get were print mags or worse, having to wait *months* between TV appearances, I now get to enjoy bodybuilder around the clock every day from the comfort of my own home.

If you're complaining about that, then I really don't think there's any way that you can be satisfied.


So true Tre. So very True... In addition to what you said above, where else can you interact with fbb athletes/celebrities? ;) You will probably not see that in any other sport...

[Eddie]

D.B. - you can't compare bodybuilding to figure.

Of course its more likely to see figure models on TV, because their basically no different than pagent girls or playboy bunnies.

A little more muscle than average, but not by much, especially today's figure girls.

Not like it was during the 90's era of Monica Brant, Lena Johanssen, and Carol Semple.

Now those babes carried some serious muscle and carried it very well.

And I know Monica and Lena were featured in different media outlets many times.

Kiana Tom with her morning workout show was very popular, she even had more muscle than today's fitness athletes.

So its not really the ladies of fitness & figure who are the problem, its the Male Bodybuilders.

Now I personally don't like judging men, but I know they don't represent what mainstream society views as appealing.

Anytime an show feature a workout segment its to encourage people to look Hollywood actors such Tom Cruise or Matt Damon.

That's how they feel most guys in the world should look, and their not even close to being on the level of IFBB BBers.

So its them that are holding the sport back from returning to the TV airwaves.

And Tre' - I'm not complaining. I agree the net is better.

I'm just saying those are making efforts to complain are just wasting their time.