For Mature Audiences Only

[cbdetroit]

Gene, James & Hans as well as to anyone of the posters from the West Coast.

This past Tuesday I've checked out this show that was broadcasted on one of the channels on Dish Network that there was a Woman who've done Adult Films that goes by the Name of Aria Noir or just simply Aria who has also competed in either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest (which was either a State or National Qualifier).

And she won 2nd place in the Figure competition. I swear that I'm not making this up folks nor am I promoting anything "XXX" rated, this actually happened.

But Guys I was curious (especially Gene & James) since you're West-coast based if this was true and if either one of you or both have attended that contest because her real name was not revealed on TV for Personal Reasons.

Again she came in 2nd place at either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest in the Figure division. Please feel free to let me know, Thanks.

[MarkH]

That was the name she competed as. What's the big deal?

[Maxt]

It is somewhat of a scandal if indeed she was doing xxx films while competing in a Figure contest. It probably does not put the sport in its best light?

[Duckbump]

It is somewhat of a scandal if indeed she was doing xxx films while competing in a Figure contest. It probably does not put the sport in its best light?


Which is dumb because there is nothing wrong with porn as far as I'm concerned. Some good ol adult entertainment!!!

[cbdetroit]

Hey Mark it's no big deal. I've was just noticing this earlier this week when it was broadcasted.

As a matter of fact, Aria looked very Beautiful, Classy & Attractive. My compliments to her training partner as well as her Trainer for putting together a Wonderful Detailed Package in a Figure International/Figure Olympia kind of way.

And as far as what she does in her spare time is her business. I'm not knocking what she does at all. Whatever makes her Happy it's all Good. Peace, Hollerback.

[Eddie]

Maybe some promoters and judges actually think its a good thing for figure girls to expose themselves in that manner.
Since their basically apart of the federation to primarily be eye-candy anyway. All you see in magazine is their "hotshots"

Of course I believe it is indeed pathetic and distasteful.:fitz:

[BigD]

Gene, James & Hans as well as to anyone of the posters from the West Coast.

This past Tuesday I've checked out this show that was broadcasted on one of the channels on Dish Network that there was a Woman who've done Adult Films that goes by the Name of Aria Noir or just simply Aria who has also competed in either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest (which was either a State or National Qualifier).

And she won 2nd place in the Figure competition. I swear that I'm not making this up folks nor am I promoting anything "XXX" rated, this actually happened.

But Guys I was curious (especially Gene & James) since you're West-coast based if this was true and if either one of you or both have attended that contest because her real name was not revealed on TV for Personal Reasons.

Again she came in 2nd place at either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest in the Figure division. Please feel free to let me know, Thanks.


Umm, I am not getting why this has to be asked if it is true. What is the actual question. There are several competitors in porn films, Danise Masino and her girls do their own, no one even bats an eye at it. IMDb lists her in about 220 films.

[cbdetroit]

Maybe some promoters and judges actually think its a good thing for figure girls to expose themselves in that manner.
Since their basically apart of the federation to primarily be eye-candy anyway. All you see in magazine is their "hotshots"

Of course I believe it is indeed pathetic and distasteful.:fitz: As far as I'm concerned there's nothing pathetic & distasteful about the situation period!! More power to the Ladies. :)

BILL CLINTON: One of America's Greatest Presidents Period. (1993-2001)

[cbdetroit]

Umm, I am not getting why this has to be asked if it is true. What is the actual question. There are several competitors in porn films, Danise Masino and her girls do their own, no one even bats an eye at it. IMDb lists her in about 220 films. Thanks Doug Good Buddy for telling it like it is.:)

Most folks don't make a Big Deal out of the Situations execpt for the Conservative Republicans.:stupid: :fitz:

[BigD]

Thanks Doug Good Buddy for telling it like it is.:)

Most folks don't make a Big Deal out of the Situations execpt for the Conservative Republicans.:stupid: :fitz:


LOL. Now I am gonna want to find a couple of her films, thanks to you!

[Eddie]

:wtf:

You don't find it distasteful when those girls just give their bodies up like that just for money?
I doubt anyone is making them do it, and don't seem to be in desprate or helpless situations where they need to do it.
How anyone can condone that kind of activity is simply pittyful! No class, respect, or dignity what so ever.

Guess we are learning what kind of person you are Chris (from Detroit)

[cbdetroit]

LOL. Now I am gonna want to find a couple of her films, thanks to you!LOL Hey you're welcome Good Buddy. Just like in the other thread of "FBBs Doing Porn" the one's who have done all of the whinning and complaining have way too much G.O.P. on the Brains.

Plus I have a couple of videos from WPW/Ray Maritn, a couple of Bodybuilding/Fitness Contests as well as videos from Muscle Elegance which in my opinion are in Good Taste period.

Plus I've met Denise Masino at the Bulk Nutrition booth at the Arnold Fitness Expo back in March along with Gayle Moher and both Ladies are just as Beautiful in Person as they are on stage, TV, print & on the Net.

I'm Glad to see Denise bringing back the class back to the stage, she & Gayle are my Heroes.:)

[diggs]

...I'm Glad to see Denise bringing back the class back to the stage...

I'm all for giving Denise the kudos she deserves but "bringing back the class"?

Dude, c'mon. Seriously.

[cbdetroit]

:wtf:

You don't find it distasteful when those girls just give their bodies up like that just for money?
I doubt anyone is making them do it, and don't seem to be in desprate or helpless situations where they need to do it.
How anyone can condone that kind of activity is simply pittyful! No class, respect, or dignity what so ever.

Guess we are learning what kind of person you are Chris (from Detroit)First off Eddie now before you start to jump to conclusions over nothing, I'm not gloryfing the subject but these Ladies are adults and if they're ok with the type of activites that they're involved in their own time outside of training & competing for the stage is their business so who are we to judge.

Remember we're not talking about minors but grown adults And they're people too. It's not right to force our personal values/morals on other adults but to go ahead and "handle our business".

Live & Let Live.;)

P.S. And if they're not happy with the type of activities that they're doing then they'll step down from it on their own accord. So chill out Eddie there's nothing to flip out over Nothing period.

[cbdetroit]

So far the responses have been constructive so far with the exception of one individual so thanks Ladies & Gentleman for your thoughts on this subject. More Power to the Ladies of the Sport. They'll have my support. :)

[cbdetroit]

I'm all for giving Denise the kudos she deserves but "bringing back the class"?

Dude, c'mon. Seriously.Diggs, the 2007 Ms. International was Denise's first contest since the 2004 Ms. Olympia in which she was in the top 3 of the Women's Lightweight Class and at this past Arnold's she was just as Beautiful & in Fine Form as she was back in '04.

And yes I'm Glad that Women like Denise & Cathy LeFrancois came back to the Bodybuilding stage with all of the Beauty, Grace & Style that they've possessed.

Makes me feel proud to be a long time fan of the sport of Women's Bodybuilding & Fitness.:D :)

[Eddie]

What do you mean who are we to judge?

They put themselves in the public eye with actions, and therefore open themselves up for criticism.
Fair or not that the way it is and always will be til the end of time.

The fact that you even think like that, just shows you don't care about the credibility of the sport at all.
Your just one who wants to fulfull your little petty fantasties.

Some fan you are . . . guess your really nothing more than horny gawker.:fitz:

By involving themselves in pornography, not are they a danger to themselves but to the people around them.

And if you cared to see them have a good decent life, you would want something to be done to end it.

Also if you didn't know other athletes, musician, and policitians are in the same boat.

Why the hell do you think Bill Clinton got into as much trouble as he did.

Why do you think athletes like Adam "Pacman" Jones and Micheal Vick are in hot water
with the law and the NFL, it is indeed because of their recent off field actions.

These people can't just go out and do whatever they want and expect to be appreciated for it.
Not to mention avoiding having to face some concequences eventually.

Their expected to maintain a high standard of morality at all times.

And when they cross the line, they should be pentalized and not allowed
to continue to participate in sanctioned sporting activities. It's only fair.

[diggs]

...And yes I'm Glad that Women like Denise...came back to the Bodybuilding stage with all of the Beauty, Grace & Style that they've possessed...

Absolutely. Like I said, Denise does indeed deserve kudos for her many qualities and accomplishments. Beauty, grace and style are among those, most definitely. You could also add tenacity, ambition, intelligence, perserverance, moxie, chutzpah, entrepreneurial spirit, courage, passion, creativity - a long, long list of positive qualities. I'm a fan.

But "class"? She's entirely too fond of pulling her snooch open for that.

[diggs]

...Why the hell do you think Bill Clinton got into as much trouble as he did....

I read this post and I thought to myself that this is the kind of non sequitir that only someone who wasn't old enough to have voted for Clinton would make. So I checked your profile and, sure enough, I was right.

To answer your question, Clinton was impeached as the result of a reactionary arch-conservative movement that was looking to reassert the influence that the Republican Party lost after the Reagan era by exploiting the only weakness of what was otherwise the most effective and popular Democrat chief executive since Kennedy. Many political historians will tell you that this moral microscope that you are so in favor of here is actually of enormous detriment to the fabric of society, effectively keeping the best and brightest from seeking public office because they do not want their pasts (and the pasts of their loved ones) unfairly and unreasonably probed and exposed to a judgemental and unthinking public when the issues at hand are not only irrelevant to the job at hand but frankly, nobody else's business.

Now let me go out on a limb here and say that this is not a point that needs to be made in a thread about muscle porn.

It's not that I agree or disagree with you or with cbd or whoever. I have nothing but respect for your right to your own opinion. But bringing Clinton into it? Ooooo, you must be really serious then. :headscrat

Too often, posters here lose all perspective. Say, for example, holding a female bodybuilder up to the same moral standard as the President of The United States just because they're both public figures. That's retarded. There was another thread several weeks ago where someone called someone else a Nazi just because they got their facts wrong. Utterly retarded. No perspective at all.

If you want to condemn people that engage in porn, go for it. Just try and be reasonable about the analogies you make and the conclusions you draw.

[siouxcountry]

:wtf:

You don't find it distasteful when those girls just give their bodies up like that just for money?
I doubt anyone is making them do it, and don't seem to be in desprate or helpless situations where they need to do it.
How anyone can condone that kind of activity is simply pittyful! No class, respect, or dignity what so ever.

Guess we are learning what kind of person you are Chris (from Detroit)


Eddie,

As long as they are not forced to do porn, I have no problem with it. They are grown women, and It's none of my business.

I do not think less of someone because they do porn.

[cbdetroit]

What do you mean who are we to judge?

They put themselves in the public eye with actions, and therefore open themselves up for criticism.
Fair or not that the way it is and always will be til the end of time.

The fact that you even think like that, just shows you don't care about the credibility of the sport at all.
Your just one who wants to fulfull your little petty fantasties.

Some fan you are . . . guess your really nothing more than horny gawker.:fitz:

By involving themselves in pornography, not are they a danger to themselves but to the people around them.

And if you cared to see them have a good decent life, you would want something to be done to end it.

Also if you didn't know other athletes, musician, and policitians are in the same boat.

Why the hell do you think Bill Clinton got into as much trouble as he did.

Why do you think athletes like Adam "Pacman" Jones and Micheal Vick are in hot water
with the law and the NFL, it is indeed because of their recent off field actions.

These people can't just go out and do whatever they want and expect to be appreciated for it.
Not to mention avoiding having to face some concequences eventually.

Their expected to maintain a high standard of morality at all times.

And when they cross the line, they should be pentalized and not allowed
to continue to participate in sanctioned sporting activities. It's only fair.LOL Well Eddie as far as "Horny Gawking Petty Fantasies" are concerned; CalJoe, Echo & Chris1000 among others at these Forums have already called you out on your true colors prior to your 1 week banishment.:p

And remember, you made that choice to put in your 2 cents on this thread.

So far the majority has spoken on this subject. Plus your current President is waisting usless mantime on a sensless war in the Middle East but doesn't give a hoot over a region of the country (The U.S. Gulf Region) plus High Unemployment, Gas Prices & so forth.

Now as far as the Ladies are concerned again, they're grown adults and what they do outside of Bodybuilding & Fitness is they're business and if they're Happy so be it. More power to them.

Right now I have no time for anymore "online wars" and let's get back to the program. ;)

[Echo]

It's not that I agree or disagree with you or with cbd or whoever. I have nothing but respect for your right to your own opinion. But bringing Clinton into it? Ooooo, you must be really serious then. :headscrat

If you want to condemn people that engage in porn, go for it. Just try and be reasonable about the analogies you make and the conclusions you draw.

Diggs:

"Eddie" did not raise the subject of Bill Clinton on this thread. Eddie responded to CBDetroit's post #8 in which CBDetroit declared Bill Clinton as "one of America's greatest Presidents."

Therefore, your criticism would be more appropriately directed toward CBDetroit since it was he who seems to feel that the mention of Bill Clinton bears some sort of relevance to the topic at hand. Moreover, regardless of one's political leanings, CBDetroit's declaration of Bill Clinton as "one of America's greatest Presidents" is arguable to begin with.

[diggs]

Fair enough. Arguable as that point may be, cbd was just using it as a signature line (as far as I can tell). Eddie used it in his argument, which is what brought it to my attention. But I suppose if Eddie meant it to be ironic then you're right - my recriminations aren't appropriate here.

CBD, you might consider changing your Clinton line to "the greatest President in the last twenty years." Then it wouldn't be arguable anymore.:joker:

[Echo]

While some forum members feel that pornography is a tolerable reality with respect to some bodybuilding competitors, the fact of the matter is that pornography does not enhance the marketability of bodybuilding or bodybuilding competitors to the public at large.

In the motion picture and television industry, a history of pornography is often the "kiss of death" to actors who aspire roles in "legitimate" movies and theatre. Very few actors have successfully transitioned from porn to mainstream television or film careers. Why would anyone expect a different reality for bodybuilders?

Yes, it is true that bodybuilders such as Autumn Raby and Denise Masino are involved in porn, or forms of it. In general, the female bodybuilders who are involved in porn tend to target the tastes of a rather narrow market of predominantly male fetishists who, in my opinion, harbor certain physical and/or psychosexual inadequacies or fantasies.

Since someone earlier raised the name of Denise Masino, let's be very honest and ask the question: What is the unique feature that Denise is predominantly marketing? Is she predominantly marketing her beautiful appearance? Is she predominantly marketing her "femininity"? Is she predominantly marketing female bodybuilding and large muscles to a wide spectrum of viewers?

To be sure, one can suggest that Denise is an attractive looking lady with an impressive physique, but the fact of the matter is that Ms. Masino predominantly markets her "signature" attribute, namely, a clitoris that has been enlarged to colossal proportions, presumably by significant steroid intake. Let's be honest my forum friends, this is what she is "selling." Does anyone believe that such a "selling point" enhances the marketability of female bodybuilding over a broad spectrum? Would it be unreasonable for some in the Women's bodybuilding community to consider this an embarrasment to the sport?

Pornography is reportedly a billion dollar plus industry. For better or for worse, it is here to stay. Bodybuilders engage in it to make money, nothing more nothing less. It is not a cause for celebration in the sport. It is a reality that, in the long run, is probably a net negative.

[Grant]

Maybe this belongs on that "FBBs and Porn" thread, because it's so general; I'm not sure. I've said this here before (and maybe got kind of repetitive about it), but just about the only thing involving FBBs and nudity that bothers me is when they become connected with Playboy. This has NOTHING to do with immorality or bad taste (after all, that magazine's considered just about the LEAST distasteful thing involving nudity). Instead, it's because of this - it seems like almost ANY given woman who's in the public eye considers "posing for Playboy" the one single thing that says she's "arrived." Including some FBBs. Or at least, that's what the general public seems to think about it. (Even when they MAKE FUN OF a woman for doing it - and that happens a lot - they STILL treat it as some earth-shaking event.) So to me, it's just the opposite of controversial, it's a huge, huge RITUAL that they go through, that I get really, really tired of hearing about, INSTEAD of morally offended. So even though I'm not a fan of "XXX" stuff, whenever I hear of ANY well-known woman involved in it (or doing any OTHER kind of not-so-famous nude appearance), I think (and this is no joke), "Well, at least she's not appearing in Playboy - that would've been so predictable!"

[Scott]

Maybe this belongs on that "FBBs and Porn" thread, because it's so general; I'm not sure. I've said this here before (and maybe got kind of repetitive about it), but just about the only thing involving FBBs and nudity that bothers me is when they become connected with Playboy. This has NOTHING to do with immorality or bad taste (after all, that magazine's considered just about the LEAST distasteful thing involving nudity). Instead, it's because of this - it seems like almost ANY given woman who's in the public eye considers "posing for Playboy" the one single thing that says she's "arrived." Including some FBBs. Or at least, that's what the general public seems to think about it. (Even when they MAKE FUN OF a woman for doing it - and that happens a lot - they STILL treat it as some earth-shaking event.) So to me, it's just the opposite of controversial, it's a huge, huge RITUAL that they go through, that I get really, really tired of hearing about, INSTEAD of morally offended. So even though I'm not a fan of "XXX" stuff, whenever I hear of ANY well-known woman involved in it (or doing any OTHER kind of not-so-famous nude appearance), I think (and this is no joke), "Well, at least she's not appearing in Playboy - that would've been so predictable!"

Like Olympic swimmer Amanda Beard is on the cover of this months Playboy, its kind of like you want beer but not the buzz so u choose to drink ODoul's instead of Budweiser. I suspect if Beard had appeared on some nude type website or mag other than Playboy then Sportscenter and SI would be making a big whoopie do over it.

[roman]

Some may call my reply simplistic and naive, but perhaps the very reason a few of the female bodybuilders, physique and fitness athletes choose to do porn and nude photography is that they are simply trying to make ends meet. There is not alot of money to go around in their chosen sport, and wanting to remain as a competitor they do what they can "on the side". There is dedication and sacrifice made by all of these ladies, far greater than any of us is prepared to take. They love their sport. Who among us has the right to say what they are doing is wrong?

I say to those of you do not look at them nefariously, it's not fair in my opinion. Are you yourself beyond reproach? Beyond contempt? I know that I am not.

[Grant]

I'm glad you mentioned that because (though I know I'm harping on the same thing as before), whenever I hear about a well-known woman doing that thing I've been complaining about, I actually HOPE that she IS doing it for the money. Again, not because it offends me, but because her "doing it for the money" actually sounds like a BETTER reason to me than her wanting so much to go through that ritual (as I keep calling it) with that magazine. And what's true of that is true of less famous nude appearances. In other words, even if you're put off the nude stuff (either for moral reasons, or for my kind of weird reason when it comes to that magazine), maybe they're just doing what makes sense to them money-wise.

[diggs]

Some may call my reply simplistic and naive, but perhaps the very reason a few of the female bodybuilders, physique and fitness athletes choose to do porn and nude photography is that they are simply trying to make ends meet....

I don't think that's naive to say - but a simpler answer might even be that they just want to preserve a glorious image of the physiques that they've worked so hard to sculpt in the grandest fashion imaginable by a professional photographer that is at the top of his game. Say what you will about Playboy but their photographers and retouchers are top notch. If I had a body of the caliber as some of these ladies, I'd want to preserve that image too.

After all, not everyone can be a Diana Dennis. I swear it's like that woman doesn't age. You don't think she drinks baby blood, do you?

[Zennie]

What do you mean who are we to judge?

They put themselves in the public eye with actions, and therefore open themselves up for criticism.
Fair or not that the way it is and always will be til the end of time.

The fact that you even think like that, just shows you don't care about the credibility of the sport at all.
Your just one who wants to fulfull your little petty fantasties.

Some fan you are . . . guess your really nothing more than horny gawker.:fitz:

By involving themselves in pornography, not are they a danger to themselves but to the people around them.

And if you cared to see them have a good decent life, you would want something to be done to end it.

Also if you didn't know other athletes, musician, and policitians are in the same boat.

Why the hell do you think Bill Clinton got into as much trouble as he did.

Why do you think athletes like Adam "Pacman" Jones and Micheal Vick are in hot water
with the law and the NFL, it is indeed because of their recent off field actions.

These people can't just go out and do whatever they want and expect to be appreciated for it.
Not to mention avoiding having to face some concequences eventually.

Their expected to maintain a high standard of morality at all times.

And when they cross the line, they should be pentalized and not allowed
to continue to participate in sanctioned sporting activities. It's only fair.

Eddie. While I understand your anger over the assumed -- because I'm not there to hear you -- anger over the negatives of objectification, I must disagree with your presentation of your concern.

It comes off as psychotic.

The use of bold letters. The "holier than thou" presentation of an idea. It reads of a desire on your part for social control. Perhaps you would like martial law?

The reality is that women do choose to show their bodies. Heck, on Friday, the number one video on YouTube was of a Ford model in a bikini. It got over 300,000 views, twice the average number for a #1 ranked video.

This is the result of freely available digital content. Women do have the freedom to select their path. But hey, so does anyone else.

In all, I find your rant -- but certainly not you -- to be rather distasteful given the seeming desire for some to exhibit a want for social control.

Let God decide the issue.

Please.

Meanwhile, if you're really interested in "change" start an ad campaign featuring FBBs and sell it to a company!

In other words, do what we do at SBS, and actually work to make change in some small way.

[cbdetroit]

Fair enough. Arguable as that point may be, cbd was just using it as a signature line (as far as I can tell). Eddie used it in his argument, which is what brought it to my attention. But I suppose if Eddie meant it to be ironic then you're right - my recriminations aren't appropriate here.

CBD, you might consider changing your Clinton line to "the greatest President in the last twenty years." Then it wouldn't be arguable anymore.:joker:LOL All right Diggs you've Got it.:joker: :420 man:


BILL CLINTON: (1993-2001) The Greatest U.S. President in the last twenty years.

[cbdetroit]

Zennie, Scott, Roman & Diggs; couldn't have said it better myself, those are some Good words of wisdom. Plus some of those indiviuals that have put on a "facade" like they're so pure are the ones who's engaging in those illicit acts.

And again we're not talking about "minors" (females under 18 years old/"jailbait"), but Grown Women 18 years and older who have a choice on what they do in their spare time.

If they're comfortable and don't have a problem with their chosen professions outside of training and competing in Bodybuilding, Fitness or Figure then again who are we to judge? When they're ready to step down from those professions, then they'll do so at they're own free will. So be it, just like I've said, Live and Let Live.

But I'm going to say this just like I've said over at the Why FBB's doing porn" thead that it's so funny (strange/bizzare) that here in the U.S. with all of the censorship as well as the conservative climate here in this country in regards to Sex, or the Adult Industry that there's a high % of out of wedlock births, VD and so forth while over in the European continent folks are more open towards Sex and they don't have as much as a high % some of the same things that I've mentioned. So Go Figure what's up with that?

Maybe Femalemusclefan as well as some of the European members of these Forums could shed some light on the subject. :cool:

[Eddie]

Eddie. While I understand your anger over the assumed -- because I'm not there to hear you -- anger over the negatives of objectification, I must disagree with your presentation of your concern.

It comes off as psychotic.

The use of bold letters. The "holier than thou" presentation of an idea. It reads of a desire on your part for social control. Perhaps you would like martial law?.

Once again, another case of someone not thinking before they write.

I'm not looking for any "social control" . . I simply responded to Chris because he saw fit to respond to my opinion.
I didn't ask for a response but gave one anyway so I retured the favor.

Writing in bold letters has nothing to do with wanting control.

I did it because I felt like doing it. I don't see you saying the same thing about Siouxcountry who does it all time.

So apparently you have some problem with me and my opinions.
This isn't the first time you said I was saying something irrational.

So maybe your the one who has issues of you own you need to work out.

[Eddie]

Aside from Echo, its ashame that none of you understand the point I was trying to make.

I swear its like trying to talk sense to a brickwall sometimes.:banghead:

I'm well aware that everyone in this country has freedom to do what they want.

Doesn't mean that everything people do is right and should be condoned.

If they want to be in porn then it is their business, but they should then step down from being active competitors in the fitness industry.

Organizations do not want to be linked to something as degrading as porn. As Echo said it does not help the credibility or marketability of the sport.

That is where I believe the problem is and not with the ladies personal lives.

And I won't comment any further on the perspectives of you so-called fans.

I'm sure the athletes on here who have read what you all have to say have a good enough idea of what your about.

[Zennie]

Once again, another case of someone not thinking before they write.

I'm not looking for any "social control" . . I simply responded to Chris because he saw fit to respond to my opinion.
I didn't ask for a response but gave one anyway so I retured the favor.

Writing in bold letters has nothing to do with wanting control.

I did it because I felt like doing it. I don't see you saying the same thing about Siouxcountry who does it all time.

So apparently you have some problem with me and my opinions.
This isn't the first time you said I was saying something irrational.

So maybe your the one who has issues of you own you need to work out.

HAAAA! Man. Is that the best you can do? This is a howler!!!

[cbdetroit]

I read this post and I thought to myself that this is the kind of non sequitir that only someone who wasn't old enough to have voted for Clinton would make. So I checked your profile and, sure enough, I was right.

To answer your question, Clinton was impeached as the result of a reactionary arch-conservative movement that was looking to reassert the influence that the Republican Party lost after the Reagan era by exploiting the only weakness of what was otherwise the most effective and popular Democrat chief executive since Kennedy. Many political historians will tell you that this moral microscope that you are so in favor of here is actually of enormous detriment to the fabric of society, effectively keeping the best and brightest from seeking public office because they do not want their pasts (and the pasts of their loved ones) unfairly and unreasonably probed and exposed to a judgemental and unthinking public when the issues at hand are not only irrelevant to the job at hand but frankly, nobody else's business.

Now let me go out on a limb here and say that this is not a point that needs to be made in a thread about muscle porn.

It's not that I agree or disagree with you or with cbd or whoever. I have nothing but respect for your right to your own opinion. But bringing Clinton into it? Ooooo, you must be really serious then. :headscrat

Too often, posters here lose all perspective. Say, for example, holding a female bodybuilder up to the same moral standard as the President of The United States just because they're both public figures. That's retarded. There was another thread several weeks ago where someone called someone else a Nazi just because they got their facts wrong. Utterly retarded. No perspective at all.

If you want to condemn people that engage in porn, go for it. Just try and be reasonable about the analogies you make and the conclusions you draw.Again I've Gotta give Diggs credit for telling it like it is. Major Props & Respect to you Diggs. :)

[cbdetroit]

Eddie,

As long as they are not forced to do porn, I have no problem with it. They are grown women, and It's none of my business.

I do not think less of someone because they do porn. Agreed 100% Sioux Country again this is only a few in the industry not the Majority.

The Bottom line again folks is that what do FBBs, Fitness & Figure Women do in their spare time outside of competition is their business and not ours.

And by the way who in the world has chosen Eddie to be the "Moral lighting Rod" of these forums?:fitz: Not The Administrators or Moderators. Again, he knew what he's getting into when he decided to respond to this thread.

Plus if those Ladies who do work in that industry don't have a problem with their chosen profession than so be it. Just the fact that the Haters out there who complain are some of the main ones who would check out the scene.

I wish that Greg the "SHADOWMAN" was back because I would Like to hear his response on the subject at hand. :)

[cbdetroit]

HAAAA! Man. Is that the best you can do? This is a howler!!!I know that's Right Zennie. :)

[roman]

Aside from Echo, its ashame that none of you understand the point I was trying to make.

I swear its like trying to talk sense to a brickwall sometimes.:banghead:

I'm well aware that everyone in this country has freedom to do what they want.

Doesn't mean that everything people do is right and should be condoned.

If they want to be in porn then it is their business, but they should then step down from being active competitors in the fitness industry.

Organizations do not want to be linked to something as degrading as porn. As Echo said it does not help the credibility or marketability of the sport.

That is where I believe the problem is and not with the ladies personal lives.

And I won't comment any further on the perspectives of you so-called fans.

I'm sure the athletes on here who have read what you all have to say have a good enough idea of what your about.


All hail! The self proclaimed "King of Cool" has spoken.

Why do you feel this need to bang your head against a brick wall? :banghead: Many see your point Eddie, doesn't mean they have to agree with it. Does it frustrate you that much that not everyone shares your opinion? You're in for a lifetime of frustration if you hope for everyone to agree with you. Eddie, I think you take these forums a little too seriously.

I have a question for you Eddie. Who are you to publicly judge people? Anybody. What their motivations are, where they are in their lives, life situation, you don't know that about them.

Another thing, you shouldn't refer to a "perceived" opinion on how athletes view some members of this forum as you did above. Because honestly you don't know. That is strictly hearsay on your part, it is NOT factual.

[Echo]

Just for fun, let's imagine that Chris Brown from Detroit marries a first grade school teacherin their local public school. Upon mutual agreement they decide that Chris' wife will supplement there income by starring in porn films. Of course, what goes on in their private lives is their own business so all of us on this forum accept their decision.

Should Chris and his wife be surprised that parents of the children in the school where Chris' wife teaches object to his wife's involvement in porn films?

Is Chris' wife's involvement in porn likely to advance their reputation in the community in which they live?

Is Chris' wife's career in public education likely to improve as a result of her porn activities?

[roman]

Just for fun, let's imagine that Chris Brown from Detroit marries a first grade school teacherin their local public school. Upon mutual agreement they decide that Chris' wife will supplement there income by starring in porn films. Of course, what goes on in their private lives is their own business so all of us on this forum accept their decision.

Should Chris and his wife be surprised that parents of the children in the school where Chris' wife teaches object to his wife's involvement in porn films?

Is Chris' wife's involvement in porn likely to advance their reputation in the community in which they live?

Is Chris' wife's career in public education likely to improve as a result of her porn activities?

First off, way to go Chris !

Echo, are you trying to make a valid point, or simply play devil's advocate?

[cbdetroit]

LOL, Well first & foremost I wouldn't get involved or marry a Woman who's in the Adult film industry so we don't have to worry about that situation.

But no offense Echo, just to "flip the script" what would you do in the same situation. ;)

[roman]

LOL, Well first & foremost I wouldn't get involved or marry a Woman who's in the Adult film industry so we don't have to worry about that situation.

But no offense Echo, just to "flip the script" what would you do in the same situation. ;)


I know that CB, my comment was made with tongue firmly in cheek.:D

[diggs]

Flip schmip! You can't compare the societal impact of a first grade public school teacher doing porn to a glorified bikini model doing porn. It's not even apples and oranges - it's like apples and doorknobs. It's not even a double standard to say that someone that has daily contact with children can't do porn and a model whose notoriety is based on the quality of her body can.

[cbdetroit]

I know that CB, my comment was made with tongue firmly in cheek.:DDon't worry Good Buddy. I knew that you wasn't talking about me.;)

[siouxcountry]

I'm sure the athletes on here who have read what you all have to say have a good enough idea of what your about.

So what am I all about, Eddie? :wtf:

[ibarramedia]

Is there any middle ground here or are we looking at two opposing viewpoints? Any compromise?

[Echo]

LOL, Well first & foremost I wouldn't get involved or marry a Woman who's in the Adult film industry so we don't have to worry about that situation.

Rewind tape:

If they're comfortable and don't have a problem with their chosen professions outside of training and competing in Bodybuilding, Fitness or Figure then again who are we to judge? When they're ready to step down from those professions, then they'll do so at they're own free will. So be it, just like I've said, Live and Let Live.

So, to summarize, in CBDetroit's world it is acceptable for women to engage in pornography. However, if a woman who engages in porn happens to be associated with CBDetroit it is no longer acceptable. Hmmm.

[Echo]

Flip schmip! You can't compare the societal impact of a first grade public school teacher doing porn to a glorified bikini model doing porn. It's not even apples and oranges - it's like apples and doorknobs. It's not even a double standard to say that someone that has daily contact with children can't do porn and a model whose notoriety is based on the quality of her body can.

O.K. Diggs, let's get this straight. You have no qualms about the President of the United States acting out a porn scene. It was just dandy for Bill Clinton to launch a "money shot" on an intern's dress in the Oval Office, "on company time" (and then lie about it in a sworn deposition involving a civil suit against him involving sexual harassment....but we won't go there).

But you are going to argue anyway about a "societal impact" arising from a school teacher going into a film studio to shoot a porn film in her private time? The school teacher is not bringing porn into her classroom any more than the female bodybuilder is engaging in porn when competing on a stage. And for you forum "puritans" I would argue that the school teacher's porn activities are intruding into her professional activities far less, if at all.

Absent an actual intrusion into the workplace or a public activity, which I personally believe is unacceptable, the question is whether pornography truly is acceptable or if it is not. There seems to be some hypocrisy on the part of some forum members who now wish to make exceptions for whom pornography is acceptable. Although I do not share "Eddie's" sweeping intolerance for pornography, it can at least be said that he is not hypocritical on the issue.

[Echo]

Is there any middle ground here or are we looking at two opposing viewpoints? Any compromise?

Yes, here it is again:

Pornography is reportedly a billion dollar plus industry. For better or for worse, it is here to stay. Bodybuilders engage in it to make money, nothing more nothing less. It is not a cause for celebration in the sport. It is a reality that, in the long run, is probably a net negative in terms of marketability and public perception of the sport of bodybuilding.

[diggs]

I can understand why it might be important to you to try and catch me being inconsistent but you're going to have to try a lot harder than this, Echo.

O.K. Diggs, let's get this straight. You have no qualms about the President of the United States acting out a porn scene. It was just dandy for Bill Clinton to launch a "money shot" on an intern's dress in the Oval Office, "on company time" (and then lie about it in a sworn deposition involving a civil suit against him involving sexual harassment....but we won't go there).

To start, the President didn't "act out a porn scene." He had oral sex.

Also, I never said I had no qualms about what he did. You're the one saying that. I said that it's ridiculous to hold a female bodybuilder to the same social and moral standards that we hold elected officials to. And then I went on to condemn those high standards for the gating effect that they would have on some potentially effective future leaders.

And I certainly didn't say that it was "dandy" for Clinton to do so. In fact, I don't see where I made a qualitative judgement on Clinton's indiscretions at all. But as long as you brought it up, I will say that it doesn't bother me and I don't believe that Bubba was the first Commander-in-Chief to get his knob polished in the Oval Office. He's just the first that got exposed.

My point with the Clinton thing was that Eddie's argument was sloppy because he was making irrelevant comparisons. Kind of like your argument is sloppy for misquoting me.

But you are going to argue anyway about a "societal impact" arising from a school teacher going into a film studio to shoot a porn film in her private time?

Of course. And if you can't understand that, I don't think I can make you understand it. But I'll make you a deal: search the Internet and if you can find one example of a first grade teacher that does porn that still has her job, I'll recant.

...There seems to be some hypocrisy on the part of some forum members who now wish to make exceptions for whom pornography is acceptable. Although I do not share "Eddie's" general intolerance for pornography, it can at least be said that he is not hypocritical on the issue.

To say that pornography should be kept away from first graders is no more hypocritical than saying that alcohol, cigarettes, handguns, R-rated movies, flamethrowers, chainsaws or any of a host of things should be kept away from them as well. Condoning pornography is not the same thing as saying that it is okay for everyone everywhere all the time. I don't see the hypocrisy you're railing against.

[Zennie]

Just for fun, let's imagine that Chris Brown from Detroit marries a first grade school teacherin their local public school. Upon mutual agreement they decide that Chris' wife will supplement there income by starring in porn films. Of course, what goes on in their private lives is their own business so all of us on this forum accept their decision.

Should Chris and his wife be surprised that parents of the children in the school where Chris' wife teaches object to his wife's involvement in porn films?

Is Chris' wife's involvement in porn likely to advance their reputation in the community in which they live?

Is Chris' wife's career in public education likely to improve as a result of her porn activities?

Echo,

I'll take that one.... First, you assume whomever Chris marries would just plain old do that without thinking at all. No.

Second, if she did, it doesnt mean she's in for a life in hell. Suppose she teaches sex education? Then she other line of work is perfect for the task at hand!

[Echo]

I said that it's ridiculous to hold a female bodybuilder to the same social and moral standards that we hold elected officials to. And then I went on to condemn those high standards for the gating effect that they would have on some potentially effective future leaders.

Again, you are raising an argument that is not relevant. The question at issue is this: In a "sport" which is already viewed with a jaundiced eye by the general public, does involvement in pornography by some of the sports participants advance or harm the marketability or perceptions of the "sport" or its athletes? That's all we are talking about. My argument is that pornography does nothing to advance the sport and, if anything, probably has a negative effect in this regard.

Beyond that, who gives a damn about the "moral standards" of the athletes and whether they are equivalent to elected officials? Athletes in this sport have included present and former criminals, drug dealers, drug abusers, pornographers, and prostitutes. Your arguments are spinning out of control, Diggs.

[Echo]

Of course. And if you can't understand that, I don't think I can make you understand it. But I'll make you a deal: search the Internet and if you can find one example of a first grade teacher that does porn that still has her job, I'll recant.

I can certainly cite examples of school teachers who have had sex with students who should have been sent to jail, but were not. But all of this is irrelevant to the subject matter of this thread.

To say that pornography should be kept away from first graders is no more hypocritical than saying that alcohol, cigarettes, handguns, R-rated movies, flamethrowers, chainsaws or any of a host of things should be kept away from them as well. Condoning pornography is not the same thing as saying that it is okay for everyone everywhere all the time. I don't see the hypocrisy you're railing against.

Diggs, if you were paying attention you would realize that your uncontrolled arguments are making my point. In post#40 I asked three rhetorical questions after raising the hypothetical situation about CB's school teacher wife who had just decided to engage in porn films.

The questions were AS FOLLOWS:

Should Chris and his wife be surprised that parents of the children in the school where Chris' wife teaches object to his wife's involvement in porn films?

Is Chris' wife's involvement in porn likely to advance their reputation in the community in which they live?

Is Chris' wife's career in public education likely to improve as a result of her porn activities?

The answers should lead one to the conclusion that involvement in pornography is not a positive image builder. Again, this underscores my fundamental point. I was not advocating that school teachers engage in porn. Indeed, I believe that if one is concerned about their public image then one should carefully consider the wisdom of engaging in pornography.

[Echo]

Flip schmip! You can't compare the societal impact of a first grade public school teacher doing porn to a glorified bikini model doing porn.

I have not discussed the "societal impact" of pornography anywhere on this thread, nor have I attempted to compare the "societal impact" between one person engaging in porn and another. These are arguments of your own contrivance. My general assertion is that pornography is not a positive image builder in the eyes of the community regardless of who is engaged in it.

[diggs]

(heavy sigh)

My arguments aren't "spinning out of control," Echo, and I haven't had to contrive anything. You just haven't kept track of where the tangents started and/or to whom I was actually responding to.

[Eddie]

Eddie, I think you take these forums a little too seriously.

I have a question for you Eddie. Who are you to publicly judge people? Anybody. What their motivations are, where they are in their lives, life situation, you don't know that about them.


Finally something is said that I actually agree with.

You hit the nail right on the head buddy, I do take forums seriously.

Hey I don't mind cracking a few jokes here and there, but I certainly don't come here to apart of some daily circus.

Now I gotta be honest and say that your 2nd question is laughable.

But I will show you respect by responding to it instead of ignoring it.

That fact of the matter is . . people are being judged everyday whether they know it or not.

When you out in a social evironment, you being sized up by everyone else that sees you inside their mind.
People formulate their own ideas and perspectives of what your about. Fair or not that's how life is, and always has been, always will be.

Some people choose to make their perceptions known and some don't.
I don't see law enforcers hunting them down and locking them up for it.

So there nothing illegal about saying what you believe about someone.
How people choose to respond to criticism is their own deal.

I have been judged many times by people in this forum, but do you see me whining about it. NO !!

I simply respond and defend myself accordingly. Whether people can handle my response or not, is not my problem, its theirs.

So don't try to make me seem like some sort of villian on here who thinks he's better than everyone.

[Eddie]

So what am I all about, Eddie? :wtf:

No Sioux . . I didn't include you in that group that I was talking about.

I actually respected your opinion a little more than theirs.:)

[Zennie]

Finally something is said that I actually agree with.

You hit the nail right on the head buddy, I do take forums seriously.

Hey I don't mind cracking a few jokes here and there, but I certainly don't come here to apart of some daily circus.

Now I gotta be honest and say that your 2nd question is laughable.

But I will show you respect by responding to it instead of ignoring it.

That fact of the matter is . . people are being judged everyday whether they know it or not.

When you out in a social evironment, you being sized up by everyone else that sees you inside their mind.
People formulate their own ideas and perspectives of what your about. Fair or not that's how life is, and always has been, always will be.

Some people choose to make their perceptions known and some don't.
I don't see law enforcers hunting them down and locking them up for it.

So there nothing illegal about saying what you believe about someone.
How people choose to respond to criticism is their own deal.

I have been judged many times by people in this forum, but do you see me whining about it. NO !!

I simply respond and defend myself accordingly. Whether people can handle my response or not, is not my problem, its theirs.

So don't try to make me seem like some sort of villian on here who thinks he's better than everyone.

Eddie. You are whining about it. That's cool; just best to admit that you are.

[cbdetroit]

Rewind tape:



So, to summarize, in CBDetroit's world it is acceptable for women to engage in pornography. However, if woman who engages in porn is associated with CBDetroit it is no longer acceptable. Hmmm.Echo, now you're getting it twisted. This is why I pretty much don't like it when folks edit stuff unless you hear the facts. I said that I wouldn't marry a Woman that's involved in the Porn industry.

And Echo, no disrespect or Hating towards you but I remember back in December that you & Eddie had a falling out that was well documented in either the "2006 Year In Review" or the "Size vs Shape" threads in which Eddie has said something terribly rude to you which was wrong. But you've given him a "well-deserved reality check for his terrible remarks with Class.

In the same sense that CalJoe & Chris10000 had given Eddie a reality check in the "Big Muscled Women" thread over at the Fan Forum during the weekend of the Arnolds for his terribly rude & nasty comments that he said towards them both as well as everyone else who've responded on that thread, which coincidently had the Administrators/Moderators of these Forums to ban him for his extreme responses.

And I gotta give CalJoe Big Props for handling the situation in a Professional manner as well, but yet Echo you're defending Eddie, ummm how strange.:confused: :headscrat

And like I've said before on page 1 Echo these are Grown Women who independently have made their choice on what they do outside of the sport and if they're happy with what they're doing so be it.

No Hating would be coming from me and besides, it's not going to affect me or anyone else whatsoever.

I'm not going to waist my time trying to tell or to force another Grown Adult what to do with their lives. I just go ahead and handle my business and that's that. Life's too short to be worrying over nothing.:cool:

Plus Echo, you didn't answer the question. Would you marry a Woman that's invloved in the Adult industry?;)

[Echo]

Echo, now you're getting it twisted. This is why I pretty much don't like it when folks edit stuff unless you hear the facts. I said that I wouldn't marry a Woman that's involved in the Porn industry.

What did I "edit out"? I quoted you verbatim.

[cbdetroit]

LOL, Awww Man. Echo feel free to check out page 1 as well as #60 on this page. Thanks. :)

[Echo]

..And Echo, no disrespect or Hating towards you but I remember back in December that you & Eddie had a falling out that was well documented.....

I have disagreed with "Eddie" on many occasions. I already said that I don't share his sweeping intolerance for pornography. The fact that I often disagree with him has no relevance to the main point of discussion on this thread.


Plus Echo, you didn't answer the question. Would you marry a Woman that's invloved in the Adult industry?;)

No.

[Echo]

LOL, Awww Man. Echo feel free to check out page 1 as well as #60 on this page. Thanks. :)

I did and I still did not post a misquoted sentence.

[cbdetroit]

I have disagreed with "Eddie" on many occasions. I already said that I don't share his sweeping intolerance for pornography. The fact that I often disagree with him has no relevance to the main point of discussion on this thread.




No.In regards to the 1st section where you've said you've disagreed when was that, I haven't seen that on this thread.:cool: Plus I've kept saying that what the Women do in their spare time outside of the sport is their personal business.

Now I'm not going to say what they do is morally right or wrong but if the Ladies are that they are involved in that industry and enjoy what they're doing, then so be it.

Beyond that for those folks that are bothered by all the Adult material out there, you do have a choice not to view the films or read the periodicals out there that would discuss/offend you. It's not the End of the World. Moving On.:)

[Echo]

In regards to the 1st section where you've said you've disagreed when was that, I haven't seen that on this thread.:cool: Plus I've kept saying that what the Women do in their spare time outside of the sport is their personal business.


You need not go further back than post #49, last paragraph. As far as the numerous disagreements between Eddie and myself on other threads, you, yourself already pointed that out in one of your previous posts.

If you re-read my posts carefully you will find that I did not make any value judgements on pornography or its "societal impact." What I did state was the opinion that involvement in pornography does not advance the public image or marketability of the sport of bodybuilding. As of this time, no one on this forum (aside from Eddie) has agreed with that relatively simple premise.

[hommes]

Echo,

I agree with your premise.

I am also sympathetic to the opinion that, understanding the consequences of their actions and proceeding within the limits of the law, women in this sport have every right to use their bodies as they see fit. It is unfortunate that the time, effort and resources required to succeed on stage in bodybuilding/figure/fitness do not generate a living income for the vast majority of participants.

Eddie is entitled to his opinion, but he could use a lesson in manners and diplomacy.

[cbdetroit]

Echo,

I agree with your premise.

I am also sympathetic to the opinion that, understanding the consequences of their actions and proceeding within the limits of the law, women in this sport have every right to use their bodies as they see fit. It is unfortunate that the time, effort and resources required to succeed on stage in bodybuilding/figure/fitness do not generate a living income for the vast majority of participants.

Eddie is entitled to his opinion, but he could use a lesson in manners and diplomacy.I agree with Hommes. Especially in that last line that he said.:)

[Grant]

There's every reason to agree with it. We're not talking about miserably rich athletes (you know the ones I mean), who go on strike and so on, till they become MORE miserably rich. We're talking about athletes in a very different situation.

[cbdetroit]

I will say this though just like over at the "Why are so many FBBs into porn" thread is what's been already well documented on other Bodybuilding threads that there have been Male Bodybuilders that has done Adult Films & no one makes a big whoopedoo but if A Women Bodybuilder, Fitness or Figure Woman were to star in a Adult Film folks would want to chastise her and to put her down which is not fair.

Those individuals who whine & complain about that stuff are no doubt some of the biggest supporters or consumers of that industry, they just won't come right out and admit it just not to tarnish their reputation as others would percieve them.

Now what cracks me up is that I'll give you an example: Now I'm sure that some of you have seen this on one of the Daytime talk shows and what happens is this you have this Guy whom either by himself or with his buddies have attended a Strip bar then all of the sudden meets what he may percieve to be "The Girl Of His Dreams" either from a Lap Dance or if she's Performing on stage.

Later on the to start dating which leads to Marriage then the Husband gets pissed at his new Wife's profession as well as that the jealousy of the Men that's been checking her out. But she's not going to give it up for him because she enjoys her profession, plus the finances helped allow them to obtain a certain economical status.

Now folks this if this Guy has a problem with his mate performing in the Adult industry, then why did he get involved with her in the 1st place? :headscrat He knew what he's getting into when he first met her. The People in the Audience as well as the Host of the Talk Show has told him that.

If he wanted a Woman with (to quote Former Vice President Dan Quayle) "Moral Values" then he wouldn't have been as quoted in the Country/Western song "Looking For Love In All The Wrong Places" if you get my drift.

Like I said before, I'm not going to say what the Ladies do is Morally Right or Wrong but they are Grown Women that knew what they're getting into and if they don't have a problem with what they do outside of Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure then so be it. :cool:

[cbdetroit]

Finally something is said that I actually agree with.

I do take forums seriously.


So don't try to make me seem like some sort of villian on here who thinks he's better than everyone.:stupid: :p

[Harry The Hat]

Since we seem to be dealing a fair bit on this thread with 'what ifs' and hypothetical situations, here's one.

What would happen in practical terms if all FBBs gave up their involvement in porn and adult sites in the morning. What do you think would follow?

Don't all answer at once.

[Echo]

Since we seem to be dealing a fair bit on this thread with 'what ifs' and hypothetical situations, here's one.

What would happen in practical terms if all FBBs gave up their involvement in porn and adult sites in the morning. What do you think would follow?

Don't all answer at once.

Not all FBB's have an involvement in porn or adult sites. Can we accurately speculate on the percentage of female bodybuilders that engage in that activity? Are the majority of FBB's reliant on such activity to meet basic living expenses?

To be sure, those that give up this activity would pursue another job or means of acquiring a financial revenue stream.

[diggs]

What would happen in practical terms if all FBBs gave up their involvement in porn and adult sites in the morning. What do you think would follow?


I'd be able to get more work done.

[Harry The Hat]

Not all FBB's have an involvement in porn or adult sites. Can we accurately speculate on the percentage of female bodybuilders that engage in that activity? Are the majority of FBB's reliant on such activity to meet basic living expenses?

To be sure, those that give up this activity would pursue another job or means of acquiring a financial revenue stream.

I'm not suggesting that all FBBs have an involvement in porn/adult sites. I'm asking what would happen if all those that do, ceased to do so.

What would be the practical effects of such a thing happening to the industry, the federations, the women and the fans?

[Echo]

I'm not suggesting that all FBBs have an involvement in porn/adult sites. I'm asking what would happen if all those that do, ceased to do so.

What would be the practical effects of such a thing happening to the industry, the federations, the women and the fans?

If the percentage of FBB's who are involved in porn is relatively small and if those involved do not constitute the "vanguard" of competing bodybuilders, then I would have to believe that the impact on the industry, the federations, and the Women would be of neutral significance. The impact on "the fans" would depend on which group of "fans" you are contemplating. Considering all groups as a whole, I would suspect that the fan impact would certainly not be negative.

[cbdetroit]

I'd be able to get more work done.LOL, Now that's a Good one Diggs. :D :)

[LarryN]

Gene, James & Hans as well as to anyone of the posters from the West Coast.

This past Tuesday I've checked out this show that was broadcasted on one of the channels on Dish Network that there was a Woman who've done Adult Films that goes by the Name of Aria Noir or just simply Aria who has also competed in either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest (which was either a State or National Qualifier).

And she won 2nd place in the Figure competition. I swear that I'm not making this up folks nor am I promoting anything "XXX" rated, this actually happened.

But Guys I was curious (especially Gene & James) since you're West-coast based if this was true and if either one of you or both have attended that contest because her real name was not revealed on TV for Personal Reasons.

Again she came in 2nd place at either the 2005 or 2006 NPC Los Angeles Bodybuilding, Fitness & Figure Contest in the Figure division. Please feel free to let me know, Thanks.

Years ago in the early 1990s there was a lady who competed in fitness in British Columbia using her stage name which she used when she was a Playboy centrefold in 1990. That lady competed using the stage name Morgan Fox.

[cbdetroit]

Years ago in the early 1990s there was a lady who competed in fitness in British Columbia using her stage name which she used when she was a Playboy centrefold in 1990. That lady competed using the stage name Morgan Fox.Wow no kidding LarryN.

Well in today's society it's no Big Deal, plus the only ones that would be doing any of the complaining against those Women who compete in Bodybuilding Fitness or Figure that may work in Adult Films or in some facet of the Adult industry are the Guys.

And with the exception of Zennie & Duckbump/Dogbump I have not yet heard from any of the Ladies of Bodybuilding, Fitness or Figure on how they feel on this issue. Oh well.:)

[Scott]

Hey Chris maybe i am misreading it but Zennie is a guy!


Wow no kidding LarryN.

Well in today's society it's no Big Deal, plus the only ones that would be doing any of the complaining against those Women who compete in Bodybuilding Fitness or Figure that may work in Adult Films or in some facet of the Adult industry are the Guys.

And with the exception of Zennie & Duckbump/Dogbump I have not yet heard from any of the Ladies of Bodybuilding, Fitness or Figure on how they feel on this issue. Oh well.:)

[cbdetroit]

Hey Chris maybe i am misreading it but Zennie is a guy!Oh I've thought on some earlier posts that Zennie's a Woman.:o My apollogies Zennie, no disrespect intended. Thanks Scott.